In my case it may be with desktop, laptop or tab. I would like to draw the complete P&ID as we have already some standards in Wonderware system platform want to make those standards with some advancement in Ignition perspective. I am still not clear how to draw this P&ID and particular manual or procedure to do this.
You need to embed an SVG on your screen. First step is to draw an SVG in whatever SVG editor you use. I use inkscape. Then you drag/drop the SVG file into your Ignition designer and click the radio button to "Embed Image".
I would recommend testing how your SVG scales with various resolutions. I've never tried drawing all of the stuff as a background image. I've seen it done but it is not my preference so I don't know how well that will work in Perspective.
I typically find the problem areas with an idea by trying to execute it and I haven't done that so I don't know what problems you are likely to encounter.
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I understand we need to go for svg to draw , does anyone know the steps for this complete P&ID screen which includes the valves,motors,analogs etc with faceplates and navigation buttons.
The real heart of the problem is a lack of 1st party drawing tools. l hope IA is releasing them soon so I can just draw them natively in a coordinate container.
I think Vision module is good enough for P&ID as its in line with P&ID editors supported by traditional SCADA systems.
Using a general purpose SVG tool like inkspace for P&ID is like using AutoCAD for drawing and importing the DXF file of graphic segments into SCADA package or building P&ID using purely the graphic element editor of Vision.
Of course, perspective's strength lies in responsive HMI which scales to all devices from mobiles, tablets, TVs, desktops etc. Perhaps a custom P&ID editor will be desirable in my opinion.
I may be wrong buts that's the impressions I get.
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Absolutely can be done, I've done a lot of P&ID's and have developed a framework of components as views based on SVG's. It took a while to get the framework together, but once that's done, we're hardly going back to Inkscape and it's just a matter of tag drop and piping tool. I have everything going back to the CSS Theme system, so no colour/font is ever defined in designer. This includes pipe colours, on/off states, text styles, alarm priorities and animation.
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I have started to come to the same conclusion. Use a coordinate container in percent mode and let it auto scale. Are your framework components pretty simple? Like basic pumps and valves? How are the load times?
I agree with your main point as Vision is a mature product and Perspective is still building features to do all the things people expect based on traditional SCADA systems. If you compare 8.0.0 to the current build it's shocking how far the product has come in such a short time. It's going to get there.
I really like the flexibility of being able to draw and import anything I want. It just takes some time to build a library of SVGs to draw P&ID. It can be done but it's a lot more work and learning curve to get there. I prefer how perspective bindings and transforms work and have gotten to the point where I would rather do a SCADA in Perspective than Vision but it wouldn't be that way if I was just starting with zero experience in both of them. It's harder and more work to do it in Perspective up until you have built a library of reuseable tools.
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Some of my SVGs are simple. Some are custom for specific jobs. Some have animated parts and CSS animations.
I built a library of custom process valves, embedded them on a screen with scripting and CSS animations to animate valves based on our company standard. From there it's just a matter of copy/pasting that embedded object and adjusting parameters to update the bindings.
Load times are something you REALLY want to consider because if you don't optimize your SVG before embedding it you can create a lot of rework for yourself. If you are using Inkscape, it is VERY important to save your SVG as type "Optimized SVG". It still makes an SVG file but it takes out all the extra nonsense that Inkscape puts in the file by default.
I've had massive file size reductions by doing that which directly impacts loading time. I did a load test on an SVG that animates color with a sample size of > 750 copies of the same device on the screen. It took in about half a second to animate all instances of the symbol when I changed the state. Performance can be pretty snappy if you optimize the SVG.
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Thanks for that info! That is very helpful.
The piping in the picture in the link, are not proportional to the vessels. I know is just a demonstration, but it would be nice to see it represented closer to a real PI&D.
That's why Ignition is free to trial! What's a better way to understand things then trying it for yourself?
@Francisco.Mejia see the pipe's properties, you can adjust as you see fit.
https://docs.inductiveautomation.com/display/DOC81/Perspective+Pipes#PerspectivePipes-PipeProperties
I keep SVG's as simple and as light as possible. Particularly the ones that are used frequently, like valves, pumps...etc. I have a large variation of vessels, and I'm not too worried about them.
Load times are critical, and it's the biggest challenge, in my opinion. I find, once the page is loaded, performance is excellent. I try to aim to keep total load time under 2 seconds, I've included some loading fade animations to make it look more appealing. Unfortunately, Perspective doesn't Cache like vision did, so it will also do a full re-load as you navigate.
I also found saving my components with no errors on them helps. The best thing you can do is use Chromes developer tools and record the loading, then investigate what's holding things up, what's making the load look ugly and take it from there. It's not just about load time, it's about how the loading looks as well. It's a time consuming process, but it's well worth it and you'll learn a lot.
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That is exactly what I have been doing. My comments are not meant to be critical of the software but to foster improvement. As a process engineer, I see some inaccuracies in the representation of some of the process equipment and I would like to help in creating a good representation.
Thanks
Francisco
I use Edraw to create SVG files from equipment and process flow diagrams.
Oh nice, I've never used edraw. I'm happy with Inkscape now. I know what you mean about representation. But I always find SCADA depictions are different to P&ID symbolism. So I prefer to draw my own. Here is a decanter for example, the P&ID symbol was more or less just a box and cone.
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There is a standard list of how process equipment and Instrumentation are depicted. There is also a process flow diagram, in addition to the Process and Instrumentation Diagram, in my opinion most of the diagrams I see here fall into the category of Process Flow.
The diagram at the top of this thread is a fairly good representation of a PI&D.
Agreed. By the way, that decanter is zoomed in, it's a small symbol as part of a large P&ID, that looks similar to the one at the top of this thread.
Mind elaborating on the chrome developer tools you use? I know about the phone emulator, but I'm wondering if there are other useful things I should know about. Thanks!